" No coals, Angmom -- you're terrific. BTW, did you ever find out anything more about the Lt. Gov?

Has anyone checked out the new Swaby's yet? I used to go there once in a while, and whenever I had visitors from out of town, I'd take them as it was such a curiosity. I think I'll like it better with food to go with the drink....

Blog rage indeed, and out of all proportion -- esp. such vitriolic criticism without even reading the content. Maybe meditation would help, or try reading a Russian novel, LOL! Now THAT takes patience. I was probably born in the wrong place and time; in the days before TV, cell phones and the Internet, those people, even the working classes when they were done with their labors, spent their free time thinking, eating good food, drinking and staying up debating their views and ideas in depth with their friends. Sounds perfectly lovely to me.

I wish you peace, naturelover, as you seem to be having a rough time finding it. (Here's a clue -- you have to find it inside yourself; when you do, the externals won't get you so flapped). "

" Ya, Spirits was a great time! It was nice meeting you Karl and it's too bad I didn't meet Chris.

Don't we already have loud dog ordinances?

Why are people complaining about the non- profit Stardust foundation? They are working on some great things that everybody in the area can and will benefit from. "

" WOW! I know I will probably be raked over the coals for this, but some people need to take a deep breath before they start launching their missiles at others. Everybody can agree to disagree, but getting nasty is just plain stupid!

cm - where can I buy those Girl Scout cookies?

Farmer's Gal - I hope you feel better soon!

Everyone - enjoy this beautiful day! "

" Welp, have decided to send out appologies and have decided to nvr post here again. Reading this two cents now instills such blog rage in me which is completely uncharacteristic of who I am. It has turned into a personals column for a chosen few r/t its intent which started with JUST two sentences about relevent matters that concern us as citizens of Auburn and the surrounding areas. "

" Glad I could provide a chuckle for ya there FG. I guess I am not the perfect paragraph prez as u! But I would imagine you caught the drift of leashes. Now I am the one amused w/the unlikely combo of the rock start and the country bumpkin. No I dont read your posts. They are long and boring and we know just about everything about u I believe except perhaps your bra size. TTFN "

" Friday night at Spirits was a good time, the place was packed and the music rocked. I met Karl and he was very cordial and seemed like a nice guy.
I've been going to Spirits for 20+ years and its a shame it is no more... "

" Still laughing at being taken to task for separating thoughts into paragraphs -- as if that were a bad thing!

BTW, still sick and home with the sinus infection; meds say to avoid sunlight for the duration. Kinda works against the other doc who wants me getting more sunlight for vitamin D deficiency. Ah, the modern condition. I'd be out there enjoying it if I could. "

" Thanks, Karl, glad someone else can say it too. It also helps that I can sit here and have a chuckle over the dogs on leases, LOL! I mean, really, how many dogs have you known who owned their own homes?

I rest my case on both counts (inability to control personal attacks AND amusing typos). "

" nature lover--seriously, back off of Farmer's Gal. YOu don't know why she may have been in or out of the house--and who's to say that she WASN'T outside? Geezus, you have some real nerve expecting someone to act in a proscribed manner as if YOU personally own and run the forums. Get over it, huh? If you don't want to read FG's posts, just pass them by. Until you can keep your own pie hole zipped, just back off, OK? Sheeesh! "

" Now... limiting the number of dogs per house hold, won't that mean less money for the city each year? "

" I can see it has been a busy day for everyone!

A good week to you all. "

" today was the start of the girl scout cookie sales! Our 3-6pm booth sold over 350 boxes! Off to a great start for their camping trip goal. Support your local troop! "

" Hurray mark! Exactly, there is so much more that needs attention then wasting several meetings on a new dog ordinance "

" And one more post so U can now say OMG isnt NL ever gonna shut up (kind of like how I feel) but Spirits just has the best memories for us. In the 80's that place was an every weekend right of passage, overdrinking, too loud music, dance till u felt like a skelelton, filled to the rafters with cig smoke, everyone is here kinda place. Remember that rancid T&M restaurant next door? John was just on the pulse for years - great guy. And how about Clear light boutique - ooh that smell and how about Marks bridal store he had for a while. That corner will always remind me of great times and friends when we ALL thought we were invincible. Sad to c it go but all good things come to an end and hoping Stardust delivers the high hopes they are talking about. "

" Anyway the dog ordinance has a lot more going for it than just noise. The basis of the ordinance was to put these dogs on LEASES - which was something most of us thought this town already had in place. Many small dogs including mine were killed by these rampant large dogs running free. And it would be quite a chuckle if it wasn't outright scary when some of these people take their dogs for walks and 'unlease' them saying so the dog can run. Then that dog comes bounding over and the owner says oh he wouldnt hurt a fly - chomp. As much as I love my dog , I cant read his mind. "

" Honest to merciless satan woman can u possibly write any more dribble. YES this is a personal attack as u call it, cripes. I c while the rest of us were out enjoying the days brite sunny demeanor you are back to you paragraphs and subs with every single word describes as to what it means to u ! geez. And the 2 cents being out of the paper has nothing to do with the bantor btwn the posters as the paper folks pick and chose what they wanted to print regardless. Its incredibly obvious it a possible law suit by the editorialist Judy was what put the kybosh on it. Not to mention some "new" officials in town want to keep it clean as it were. "

" mark -- I agree completely.

Meanwhile ...

Where I grew up in a suburban/urban area just outside Detroit, we had noise ordinances which said no power tools or other noisy stuff before 8 AM. That was marvelous. No reason you can't have such rules in a city.

But out in the country, like where I live now, farmers often need to start work at 4 or 5 in the morning, depending on the weather, time of year, etc. There's no noise ordinance out here of which I know at all.

The people from whom I rent have a handful of beef cattle, and I can tell you -- a bull who wants to get to a cow in heat is a lot louder (and scarier!) than a cow giving birth, but it is less annoying than a dog that barks all night. I suppose what's worst about the dog is knowing that it is suffering or it wouldn't be barking like that. (A dog who barks because someone has entered its territory is just doing its job and not being a "nuisance.")

Large numbers of people living in close proximity such as in cities isn't really the way we were meant to live, and it requires a lot of tolerance. Me, I get sensory overload in crowds, I hate the mall, or lots of traffic, or anywhere there is lots of noise, flashing lights, bright-colored ads all screaming for your attention, conversations going on all over, and just masses of beings all thronging together. I couldn't leave suburban-suburbia fast enough. I'll be the first to admit I can't hack city life -- some people find it invigorating, but I find it draining (like those invigorated people have sucked all the energy out of me).

Sadly, the countryside where it is more sparsely populated and where it should be more healthy and breathable is so polluted with agricultural waste in the air, the water and the soil, that it has come to be just as unhealthy as living in a factory-infested city. I must have too much of the blood of those individualists who settled this country in my veins -- I like company, and having a small group of friends around, but I sometimes wish I lived in a lone cabin in the mountains far from the madding crowds!

To each his or her own. "

" They DON'T need to crack down on the number of dogs people can own, but rather get the people who leave their dogs out for a long time.

One dog can make a heck of a lot of noise if it's left outdoors.

There are many other problems in this city and they have to go after dogs, because one person complained about dogs on Holley Street?

What about the thugs on the street, cops who tail everyone, speeding on Grant Avenue, loud music that rattles every bit of your house, trash on the roads, - should I keep going?
"

" Ever since the two idiots above me moved out, there a LOT less noise in my world, hallelujah, can I get an amen people? "

" thanks FG but brew comments doesnt faze me.
There are many noises in our daily life that affect us-basically deal with it like a grown up.
If a dog is barking so much-see why-if its because of lack of care on the owners part-then call Animal Services.
I agree that there need to be rules and fines but as Franklin stated uphold those without adding more.
As poor as most are in the city, I doubt huge fines will do anything-no one could afford to pay them!
The cow is still in labor--MOO-MOO, I hope she has a healthy baby! "

" brew I allready live out of town! speaking of noise-the neighbor around the corner has a cow in labor all night long--should I tell the cow to shush?
She was well beyond her 5 minutes of mooing past 11pm! "

" brew, that was uncalled-for. It's why this space has such a bad rep -- too many people just sniping at each other for no good reason (We also have been dissed in the past for lack of substance). We've made progress in both areas, but a little reminder to be civil once in a while doesn't hurt.

I find it interesting, perhaps ironic, that while cm and I often disagree on issues, we manage to do so with civility, respect and even friendliness. Same goes for AJ, Karl, Angmom and many folks here. But there are others who, even though I find that we often agree on issues, cannot resist the impulse to launch gratuitously nasty personal attacks. We might still have Two Cents in the print edition of the paper if it weren't for this group character flaw.

AJ, thank you very much for the recommendation of Naomi Wolf's "The End of America." The text provides not only many points of reference for me to things I have read, seen, lived or studied before, but draws them together into a clear picture. I will be highly recommending this short, easily-read book to a number of my friends at home and work, and would do the same for both Karl, cm, brew and others here as well (those with gray cells to rub together who don't have to define their lives through their adherence to a party line) -- specifically for people who have very different opinions, to see something I sincerely hope we share in common.

I thought about going to Spirits to see if I could meet up with some Two Centers in person, but I am a morning person -- up nearly every day at 4 AM and in bed by 8 or 9 PM at the latest. I am also sick with a wicked sinus infection, and the meds are making me nauseous, so I didn't feel much like going out anywhere. Pity though, because then people could have a full conversation without being taken to task for writing overly long posts!

Sometime I will write a bit about the End of America book -- my master's thesis in German lit covers a bunch of shared territory (For anyone who even ever heard of Hanns Heinz Ewers, sensation novel writer of the early 20th century, filmmaker, friend of Aleicester (sp) Crowley, Magnus Hirschfeld and Putzi Hanfstaengl, and, most surprisingly, a philo-semitic early Nazi party member -- brings our conversation nearly round full circle). For another time -- my head hurts.... "

" Just what we need, more ordinances. How about we enforce the ones we have. "

" Maybe it's worth passing this dog ordinance if it will cause CM to move out of town. "

" Lets face it, noise is everywhere!
I dislike a mower running at 8am on sunday-my sleep in day!
I dislike "thump thump from rap" at 11pm when neighbors daughter gets dropped off by friends across the street!
I dislike G&E, Brighthouse, and others doing construction work ALL DAY LONG for weeks!
BUT its life, so if the dog barks because of human or critter in my yard-good dog! "

" Apparently, I missed the news about Lt Gov Patterson and his bigotry to be excused by visual problems. Could someone fill me in?

I am visually impaired, and probably one of the least prejudicial people. I would like to hear the story. "

" Only in Auburn can you get a non-profit organization that has already committed hundreds of thousands of dollars to the community for needed improvements and all the citizens can say are something is fishy. They are probably not going to pay property taxes as they are a not for profit group and why not? They are probably moving up the timetable of Auburn's recovery by a decade. The people in this town should be asking how can I help rather than looking for what is fishy. The complainers are ungrateful idiots. "

" What is all this crap about the Starlite
Group. Just what is your problem? Someone wants to invest millions in Auburn. Why don't you try some constructive remarks instead if trying to find fault. And do some reading. He's offering to help those who want to invest themselves in Auburn. It's not free money. "

" Whoever missed the last night at "Spirits" last night missed a rockin' good time!
The bands were excellent, and I actually got to meet both "Andy B" and believe it or not, Chris Van Note in person! And yes, I still have all my teeth! LOL!
What a shame it was to know that an era was passing right before our eyes!
Man, I'm gonna miss that hole! "

" irritated -- don't hold it against the poor dog. It's being neglected and if this has been going on for some time, it probably has "chained dog syndrome." The owners need to be held accountable for their abuse of an innocent living creature as well as their disregard of their neighbor's peace.

cm -- I recently saw a bit on the news at a friend's house about the rising cost of pet health care, and how shelters are filling up with beloved pets their owners can't afford to keep. The same day, I read an article on how people who do not have cats run a 40-50% greater chance of having a heart attack or other heart ailment (dogs, for all their love and loyalty, don't have the same health benefit as cats). Like you, I prefer to have both when I can.

A lot of these laws get worked over until they really don't make much sense. Yes, something needed to be done to protect dogs from neglect and neighbors from nuisance, but all these arbitrary number limits are not sensible. It all comes down to whether or not the pets are cared for. I know a woman who is retired with a very good pension and investments. She never has fewer than a dozen cats. She takes each and every one of them to the vet twice a year for check-ups in addition to as-needed health care. They are well-fed and well-loved, and have plenty of space in her home and large grounds. On the other hand, I knew a girl who had one cat and couldn't be bothered to take care of it -- maybe like Karl's neighbors (though I believe they have more than one). It's not the number, it's the care they receive.

AJ -- I'm reading the book, about 1/3 through. A lot of these things I knew, but there are always more horrors to be learned (by me or anyone) -- many are right there in the news (for now!) but we are so awash in news that no one can keep up with it all. As such, information flooding is almost as effective as shutting down the news.

justventing -- take it another step. Ever notice that corporations who do wrong things on a grand scale have more rights than you or I do? "

" The same goes for music, accordingly to the city code, if you can hear music, racing car motors, etc. within 15 feet from a residence, you can call the police. I cannot see any reason that I have to listen to a neighbor’s loud music. Yes they have a right to listen, but they do not have a right to force me to listen to it. They should wear headphones. Ever realize that people who are doing wrong things have more rights than people who follow them? I have a right to live in a comfortable, pleasurable atmosphere ANYTIME of day. I am also glad with the new dog laws, about time. "

" I hope the new dog law passes, I cant wait to call and shut the rotten little dog up that lives behind me, after listening to it from 3-11 hours a day barking non stop I think its great that I will finally have some recourse! The owners currently couldnt care less about thier neighbors having to listen to it! "

" I think this new dog ordinance needs more working on!
The "times" of 5 minutes to 15 minutes is ridiculas!
Adding the city telling a homeowner how many pets he/she can own-limit to 3 unless your a licensed breeder?
I have yet to read about any "hoaders" in this paper.
I would have had to move from Auburn since last year at this time I had 7 dogs (mini-dachshunds) and 4 cats!
Yes, owners should be more responsible to a continuous barking dogs-If my dogs are barking for more than 3 minutes I go look. BUT I also have a doggy-door so they are free to go in & out.
Every house on my block has more than 1 pet-1 dog barks they all bark!
The fees to license animals has grown way to high! I was paying $30 per pet, not counting shots!
Pets have been proven to be a great asset for lonely elderly and sick/handicap children at home-how would they afford such costs?

If you don't pay the high fine--will the city take your dog?
"

" What kind of breaks are We given Stardust Group? Something is fishy here!! "

" If you are blind, you have my permission to be a bigot. "

" think maybe it was getting OLD !!!! "

" Since Payless probably asked them to! "

" So...I'm guessing that the "P0rn" discussion was getting a little "hot" for the editors?
Since when do ya's change "Two Cents" in the middle of the day?!?! "